Which Poison to Use for Rogues

[j***@cox.net]

I have been asking all the rogues I know what poison they prefer to
use and I have been surprised at the answers...everone I ask gives ne
adifferent one.

Any help in understanding whta poison to use and when to use that
particulkar one would be appreciated. I use a sword in the main hand
and a dagger in the off.

Thank you

[Urs Steiner]

Hia

Post by j***@cox.net
I have been asking all the rogues I know what poison they prefer to
use and I have been surprised at the answers...everone I ask gives ne
adifferent one.
Any help in understanding whta poison to use and when to use that
particulkar one would be appreciated. I use a sword in the main hand
and a dagger in the off.

I haven't played a rogue with poison yet, but from some talks with some
of them ...
you choose the poison depending on the mob you want to kill.

Example: mobs which flee at low health-> something which makes the run
slower.

naturally you have the mob sotrs a bit mixed up, but generally that's
the idea. I remember some threads here saying which poisons to use
against what kind.

BTW: don't apply poison before entering an instance. It will get removed!!

Urs

[Catriona R]

Post by j***@cox.net
I have been asking all the rogues I know what poison they prefer to
use and I have been surprised at the answers...everone I ask gives ne
adifferent one.
Any help in understanding whta poison to use and when to use that
particulkar one would be appreciated. I use a sword in the main hand
and a dagger in the off.

I think it's down to personal preference - personally I use crippling
against humanoids that run away and instant against everything else (or
crippling on mainhand and instant on offhand - most people do it the other
way round but I've got a slow sword in offhand so it's not got enough
chance of hitting before the mob runs if I do that).

Deadly is nice but fights rarely last long enough for it to have the same
damage impact as instant, and I've never even bothered making up
mind-numbing or wound, as both seem utterly useless (maybe mind-numbing is
ok in pvp but I'm pure pve)

[Lehi]

Post by Catriona R

Post by j***@cox.net
I have been asking all the rogues I know what poison they prefer to
use and I have been surprised at the answers...everone I ask gives ne
adifferent one.
Any help in understanding whta poison to use and when to use that
particulkar one would be appreciated. I use a sword in the main hand
and a dagger in the off.

I think it's down to personal preference - personally I use crippling
against humanoids that run away and instant against everything else (or
crippling on mainhand and instant on offhand - most people do it the other
way round but I've got a slow sword in offhand so it's not got enough
chance of hitting before the mob runs if I do that).
Deadly is nice but fights rarely last long enough for it to have the same
damage impact as instant, and I've never even bothered making up
mind-numbing or wound, as both seem utterly useless (maybe mind-numbing is
ok in pvp but I'm pure pve)

PVE raids - I like to use Mind-numbing on one weapon, crippling poison
on the other. When we pull a group, I head for the caster(s) and
smack the crap out of them. Easy kill (lower hp and armor) and it
keeps the spells off the rest of the party. If the casters are taken,
I work on non-mana mobs so when they try to run away they are slowed.


Bronzebeard PVE:
Avocat - Gnome Warlock
Lehi - Human Paladin
Bathsheba - Human Rogue
Pourter - Night Elf Druid

Frostmane PVP:
Laban - Troll Rogue

[Brian]

"Bother!", said Pooh, as he read Catriona R's latest post to
alt.games.warcraft.

Post by Catriona R

Post by j***@cox.net
I have been asking all the rogues I know what poison they prefer to
use and I have been surprised at the answers...everone I ask gives ne
adifferent one.
Any help in understanding whta poison to use and when to use that
particulkar one would be appreciated. I use a sword in the main hand
and a dagger in the off.

I think it's down to personal preference - personally I use crippling
against humanoids that run away and instant against everything else (or
crippling on mainhand and instant on offhand - most people do it the other
way round but I've got a slow sword in offhand so it's not got enough
chance of hitting before the mob runs if I do that).
Deadly is nice but fights rarely last long enough for it to have the same
damage impact as instant, and I've never even bothered making up
mind-numbing or wound, as both seem utterly useless (maybe mind-numbing is
ok in pvp but I'm pure pve)

Mind-numbing can be very useful in some instances. I had a really fast
off-hand (Hanzo Sword then Dal'Rends) on my Rogue, so I could get away with
keeping the status poisons on the off.

Instant Poison is almost always on my mainhand. It's the best damage
poison, since mobs generally don't last long enough in most instances for
Deadly to get stacked up right.

My offhand will change depending on what we're fighting. If I'm worried
about runners, I'll throw up Crippling. If I'm playing "gank the caster",
then I'll throw Mind-Numbing. (My Rogue specialized in "gank the caster".
Works great in most of the level 60 instances. Let the
warriors/casters/hunters worry about the main group of melee mobs, I'll
wander over here and gank the guy throwing frostbolts at our healer.) If I
just want max dps, then I'll do Instant/Instant.

Wound Poison is completely useless, don't even bother training it.

Brian

[poptarts]

I remember it was like this, with mind-numbing poison, you can slow
instant spells like Arcane Explosion (mage) and Corruption (warlock) so
they become non-instant. Very handy when fighting casters.

[Brian]

"Bother!", said Pooh, as he read poptarts's latest post to
alt.games.warcraft.

Post by poptarts
I remember it was like this, with mind-numbing poison, you can slow
instant spells like Arcane Explosion (mage) and Corruption (warlock) so
they become non-instant. Very handy when fighting casters.

Pretty sure that doesn't work that way anymore. But I haven't checked it
recently.

Brian

[Simon Nejmann]

Post by poptarts
I remember it was like this, with mind-numbing poison, you can slow
instant spells like Arcane Explosion (mage) and Corruption (warlock) so
they become non-instant. Very handy when fighting casters.

If it works, it only does because those specific spells start out
non-instant but are turned instant through talents that reduce cast
time.

In other words: You will never be able to turn eg. Blink or Frost Nova
into non-instant spells.

[Simon Nejmann]

Post by Brian
Wound Poison is completely useless, don't even bother training it.

Not completely - just nearly so. :)

A few bosses in the game heals themselves throughout the fight - Wound
Poison is a nice way of making sure they don't do it as effectively.
For example, we always ask our rogues to use Wound Poison on Jin'do
the Hexxer and Ebonroc.

[Brian]

"Bother!", said Pooh, as he read Simon Nejmann's latest post to
alt.games.warcraft.

Post by Simon Nejmann

Post by Brian
Wound Poison is completely useless, don't even bother training it.

Not completely - just nearly so. :)
A few bosses in the game heals themselves throughout the fight - Wound
Poison is a nice way of making sure they don't do it as effectively.
For example, we always ask our rogues to use Wound Poison on Jin'do
the Hexxer and Ebonroc.

I've never fought either of them, so I don't really know. But isn't Mortal
Strike a more effective debuff anyways?

Brian

[Simon Nejmann]

Post by Brian
"Bother!", said Pooh, as he read Simon Nejmann's latest post to
alt.games.warcraft.

Post by Simon Nejmann

Post by Brian
Wound Poison is completely useless, don't even bother training it.

Not completely - just nearly so. :)
A few bosses in the game heals themselves throughout the fight - Wound
Poison is a nice way of making sure they don't do it as effectively.
For example, we always ask our rogues to use Wound Poison on Jin'do
the Hexxer and Ebonroc.

I've never fought either of them, so I don't really know. But isn't Mortal
Strike a more effective debuff anyways?

Yes, but MS warriors can not be present/die/get polymorphed/get mind
controlled/and so on - a bit of redundancy is always good. :)

Hmm, now that I read up on Wound Poison I realise that it reduced
healing by a set amount (up to ~700) and not a percentage like MS - I
think that reduced the fights where it is usefull to just Jin'do the
Hexxer (but I know that we usually ask the rogues to use it on him)...

Ebonroc heals in chunks of 25000, so 700 isn't really all that
usefull. :p
Jin'do on the other hand pops down healing totems that heal him more
often in smaller chunks.

[David Carson]

Post by Simon Nejmann

Post by Brian
Wound Poison is completely useless, don't even bother training it.

Not completely - just nearly so. :)
A few bosses in the game heals themselves throughout the fight - Wound
Poison is a nice way of making sure they don't do it as effectively.
For example, we always ask our rogues to use Wound Poison on Jin'do
the Hexxer and Ebonroc.

I always use Wound Poison on Jin'do, but never bothered for Ebonroc. Is
the flat reduction really worth it when he heals himself 25000 per hit
if he attacks a cursed target??

I also use it on Mar'li in ZG, for that life drain thing she does.

Cheers!
David...

[Simon Nejmann]

On Thu, 30 Mar 2006 08:45:23 +1100, David Carson

Post by David Carson
I always use Wound Poison on Jin'do, but never bothered for Ebonroc. Is
the flat reduction really worth it when he heals himself 25000 per hit
if he attacks a cursed target??

See my other reply - in short: My memory of the poison tooltip was
wrong, and I doubt it is usefull on Ebonroc. :)

[Kai Scholz-Starke]

Post by Brian
Wound Poison is completely useless, don't even bother training it.
Brian

Actually i found a fight where it's useful - but only one so far :-)
Jin'Do the Hexxar in Zul'Gurub puts down a totem that gives him a
pretty decent Heal-over-time. Wounding poison can negate a bit of
that, even if you (as a rogue) shouldn't have too much time to apply
several charges on Jin'Do. You're way too busy to hunt Shades/totems
all the time. Magnificient fight btw - i love it :-)

I tried duelling a holy priest of ours with double wounding some time
ago. I thought, hmm, full wounding should negate his Renew.

He kited me to death .-))

Kai

[Hilda]

Instant for main hand and either crippling (if they are runners) or
deadly for second hand. If I know for sure there will be lots of
casters I'l use mind-numbing in the second hand.

[Nate Engle]

Post by Hilda
Instant for main hand and either crippling (if they are runners) or
deadly for second hand. If I know for sure there will be lots of
casters I'l use mind-numbing in the second hand.

When I play a rogue I like deadly quite a lot, but when I'm
playing a mage or druid or 'lock I'd prefer to see that
replaced with something that isn't a DoT. Maybe it's just
the group I play with, but when we get adds that I can crowd
control with a poly or a sleep or a seduce, the last thing
I want to see on any of them is a DoT.

Instant damage is probably the safest all-around bet.

[The Masada]

Post by j***@cox.net
I have been asking all the rogues I know what poison they prefer to
use and I have been surprised at the answers...everone I ask gives ne
adifferent one.
Any help in understanding whta poison to use and when to use that
particulkar one would be appreciated. I use a sword in the main hand
and a dagger in the off.

Soloing:
I tend to use Instant Poison on the main hand regardless. I don't
want a DoT poison interfering with a Gouge or Blind in case I
have to break combat for a quick bandage or to start running
away/Vanish. The off-hand is situation-dependent---if I'm
fighting humanoid mobs that run and I'm worried about adds,
I'll use Crippling Poison on the off-hand. Off-hand poison
almost always always sticks, and if I'm worried about an
Elite getting into his buddies in Hearthglen I want him stumbling
away as slow as he goes. If it's undead or animals that don't]
run, I'll just throw in Instant Poison on the off-hand weapon, too.

Grouping:
I use Instant Poison on the main hand, depending on where
the group is fighting. If we're fighting mobs that aren't
stunnable but have a ton of armor and hps, I'll sometimes
use a DoT poison. Again, Crippling Poison on the off-hand
if there is a possibilty of runners...even with the best mage
and crowd control, it's always nice if the first runner from
a group of 7 mobs can't get out of range when it decides
to go away. Mobs that don't run or have tons of hps/armor
get a DoT poison off-hand as well. The only thing that
gets Instant Poison on the off-hand is mobs that are
squishy (loads of easy-to-hit-casters) or groups where
a mob may be sheeped or (gulp) feared during a pull.
I don't want 2 mages yelling at me for having a DoT
that got applied from a single solitary hit during a mis-
target break their Poly.

Raids:
Whatever the raid leader wants :-). If he doesn't have a
preference, I'll generally go with the same strategy for
grouping, with two new exceptions. Feeble mind
poisons are great against caster-type bosses and
mini-bosses (as long as they can be poisoned in the first
place), and the poison that lowers the effect of healing
on the target if a boss or mini-boss has a lot of healing
support. Let the AoE guys worry about taking out
the healers themselves (unless I'm on duty, of course),
but making the guy not be able to healed as efficiently
as possible is a perfectly dirty roguish trick :-).